tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post6930251641163642056..comments2024-03-26T02:31:48.024-05:00Comments on Trollsmyth: Of Combat Acrobatics and Not-So-Frustrated Noveliststrollsmythhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01895349218958093151noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-60849230912313807162012-04-05T00:53:24.295-05:002012-04-05T00:53:24.295-05:00Roger Zelazny's excellent Amber series is mast...Roger Zelazny's excellent Amber series is masterful in its understatement of "fight details" while still telling a colorful, action-packed story.<br /><br />I think multiple media sources (including the still images of comic books) can be considered as contributing to the stew. Unfortunately, trying to translate this detail into an RPG is not (in my opinion) very effective at all...as I was writing about earlier today.JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08532311924539491087noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-32562341666585310822012-04-03T20:00:29.008-05:002012-04-03T20:00:29.008-05:00Aos: I was thinking the same thing, though I was h...<b>Aos:</b> I was thinking the same thing, though I was hesitant to say so, uncertain if what I remembered was Howard or de Camp. So I took a look, and I think Howard can clearly be seen as a mid-point between Dumas and the modern writer:<br /><br /><i>Murilo saw that the barbarian had locked his legs about the apeman's torso, and was striving to maintain his position on the monster's back, while he butchered it with his poniard. Thak, on the other hand, was striving to dislodge his clinging foe, to drag him around within reach of the giant fangs that gaped for his flesh. In a whirlwind of blows and scarlet tatters they rolled along the corridor, revolving so swiftly that Murilo dared not use the chair he had caught up, lest he strike the Cimmerian. And he saw that in spite of the handicap of Conan's first hold, and the voluminous robe that lashed and wrapped about the apeman's limbs and body, Thak's giant strength was swiftly prevailing. Inexorably he was dragging the Cimmerian around in front of him.<br /><br />- Rogues in the House</i>trollsmythhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01895349218958093151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-19390525097126546702012-04-03T19:49:12.308-05:002012-04-03T19:49:12.308-05:00Alexander Osias: I have yet to read those, but I&#...<b>Alexander Osias:</b> I have yet to read those, but I've heard really good things about them.trollsmythhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01895349218958093151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-40590613223620074852012-04-03T19:48:24.435-05:002012-04-03T19:48:24.435-05:00Anonymous: I'm a huge Danny Kaye fan, so yeah...<b>Anonymous:</b> I'm a huge Danny Kaye fan, so yeah, "The Court Jester" is regular viewing around the trollcave. :Dtrollsmythhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01895349218958093151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-59031787870248161092012-04-03T19:45:43.393-05:002012-04-03T19:45:43.393-05:00Roger the GS: Possibly, but so is the simple need ...<b>Roger the GS:</b> Possibly, but so is the simple need to top yesteryear's fights. Compare the Captain Blood fight, with it's duel on a beach and threat of slippery rocks, to the Robin Hood fight, up and down stairs, falling candelabra, the shadow-fight, the army clashing behind them at the end. Compare the "Troy" fight I linked in the post to the brutal but (by comparison) rather flat-footed <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNV86VFd4Zw" rel="nofollow">Battle of the Mounds</a> from "Conan the Barbarian." It's always got to be bigger and better and more epic than last time.<br /><br />Which makes me wonder what they're going to do for "The Hobbit." Sure, there's nothing like Smaug in the LotR, but the Battle of Five Armies isn't quite the siege of Minis Tirith.trollsmythhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01895349218958093151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-45928718732975815582012-04-03T19:31:20.878-05:002012-04-03T19:31:20.878-05:00purestrainhuman: Cutting to black is absolutely ve...<b>purestrainhuman:</b> Cutting to black is absolutely verboten in modern fantasy writing, and has been for quite some time. <br /><br />What's interesting is how often the greats did that. Tolkien, for instance, was notorious for drawing the curtain across scenes of violence (Bilbo being KOed by a tossed stone at the Battle of Five Armies, for instance).trollsmythhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01895349218958093151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-71988286474849366562012-04-03T10:48:56.362-05:002012-04-03T10:48:56.362-05:00Movie fighting has to be big and bold. Most real ...Movie fighting has to be big and bold. Most real sword fights don't look nearly as good on the screen. The moves are more contained, the blows look repetitive to the untrained observer, there are points where nobody actually attacks - they are jockeying ofr position and testing their opponents. Movie fighting also developed from Stage fighting where they needed to be big so that people in the cheap seats could follow the action.Philo Pharynxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05332233751045766942noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-43554300276663154622012-04-03T09:12:00.220-05:002012-04-03T09:12:00.220-05:00Many REH stories have pretty detailed fights,as do...Many REH stories have pretty detailed fights,as do some of the works of Leiber.Aoshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00145284080419502886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-89009009324136452592012-04-03T00:21:40.962-05:002012-04-03T00:21:40.962-05:00I'd like to also throw in the works of Arturo ...I'd like to also throw in the works of Arturo Perez y Reverte: The Fencing Master and the series of Alatriste novels (which were Dumas-inspired, of course) as examples of detailed combat descriptions.Alex Osiashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851139031311819958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-18120066075775004842012-04-02T19:39:43.074-05:002012-04-02T19:39:43.074-05:00You should read a bit about Basil Rathbone as well...You should read a bit about Basil Rathbone as well if you haven't already.<br /><br />http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001651/bio<br /><br />Military Cross for Bravery. He was also a fencing champion. Another great fight he did was in the comedy The Court Jester, where he parodies the fights you showed!<br /><br />John.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-68506183488361541212012-04-02T17:49:07.197-05:002012-04-02T17:49:07.197-05:00You beat me to it. After my comments on the discon...You beat me to it. After my comments on the disconnect between high level D&D combat grinding and its literary sources I was going to point out the tendency to write extended fight scenes into post-D&D literature and point out several grinding combats in the Game of Thrones saga for example.<br /><br />http://rolesrules.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/by-way-conan-never-leveled-up.html<br /><br /><br />Your film example nails it. I can't prove it, but I firmly believe that D&D combat (possibly filtered through its CRPG heirs) is responsible.<br /><br />Though yeah, "padding their page count" is a possible alternate explanation.Roger G-Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08594440701279968693noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28751902.post-57614134840539498732012-04-02T15:42:10.125-05:002012-04-02T15:42:10.125-05:00It's interesting, because you really can't...It's interesting, because you really can't get away with the "cutting away from combat" technique in film. Consider the howls of rage that eminated from numerous homes during the 3rd season finale of Heroes, where Peter and Nathan engage in the battle royale with Sylar, while the audience is treated to colorful reflections in Claire's eye as it looks through the keyhole. Was it an interesting scene, sure, but it wasn't what the audience wanted. To be honest, I'm not sure how much of that has leaked into print media, how much is our societal desire for more and more realism, even within our escapist fantasies, and how much of it is authors padding their page count.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08116201484230607793noreply@blogger.com